Good Reason

It's okay to be wrong. It's not okay to stay wrong.

Category: religion (page 15 of 36)

Why are we moral? It’s a problem — for Christians.

One of the main themes of the ‘Collision’ discussion was morality. Ben the Christian had no argument with the idea that atheists could be moral, but he thought they were borrowing Christian morality (which actually predates Christianity). Like Wilson in the film, he argued that Christians could explain why a deed was moral or immoral (God seddit), but atheists couldn’t.

In fact, atheists can explain why we’re moral: we have brains (with, yes, mirror neurons) that can feel the feelings of others. When we see someone that’s hurt or sad, we feel like it’s happening to us, and we don’t like it. This gives rise to compassion, empathy, and all those nice things.

Here’s the interesting part (and this line of thinking arose out of a discussion with Mark Ellison):
• A theory is better if it explains more.
• Atheists can explain why atheists and Christians are moral.
• Christians can explain why Christians are moral, but they have no idea why atheists are moral.
• Their theory explains less. This is a problem for their theory, not for the theory of atheists.

No, really, they simply have no idea why atheists are moral. Take a look at the recent column from Billy Graham.

DEAR DR. GRAHAM: The kindest, most thoughtful person I know says she’s an atheist and doesn’t even believe in God. I always thought we needed to believe in God before we’d behave like she does, but I guess this isn’t necessarily true, is it?

[Graham responds:] Why is she such a kind and thoughtful person? I don’t know the reason; perhaps she simply has a sunny personality (as some people do), or perhaps her parents taught her to be kind and considerate when she was growing up. But I do know this: She’s not this way because she’s an atheist. In fact, she’s this way despite her atheism — because a true atheist has no real reason to believe in right and wrong or to behave sacrificially toward others.

But if they do behave this way, and you can’t explain it, doesn’t that mean there’s something lacking in your explanation, and not with atheism?

By making this argument, Christians are trying to give us their problem. But the difficulty inherent in their position belongs to them.

Mormonville

It would appear that some Perth Mormons fell for a Ponzi scheme.

A woman has defrauded Perth residents of more than $4 million by selling shares in a bogus land development she called `Mormonville’, police say.

West Australian Police fraud officers, who have charged the 50-year-old registered finance broker on 24 fraud-related counts, say many of the woman’s victims were pensioners.

They said the woman, from Canning Vale in Perth’s south, set up “illusory schemes” in 2007 to fund her personal investments and affairs.

“She tricked people to invest by offering exceptionally high rates of returns with little or no risk to invested money,” a police spokeswoman said on Friday.

The initial schemes allegedly involved selling investments in part-shares of land but later evolved into a scheme advertised as Mormonville, which claimed to be a village-type development for members of the woman’s church.

Anyone can fall for a scam, religious or not. All it takes is a lack of critical thinking or just lack of experience in detecting frauds. But it’s easy to get people’s guard down by appealing to shared values, especially religious ones. I guess once you’ve found a group of religious believers, you can assume a certain level of gullibility right off the bat.

And all to make a Mormon village. It’s too bad the victims were pensioners, but I can’t say I sympathise much with a desire to establish religious tribalism.

Collision! Aftermath

Last night saw the screening of ‘Collision‘, a combined event for the UWA Christian Union and the UWA Atheist and Agnostic Society.

Festivities actually got started earlier in the day, as Ben Rae (from the Christian Union) and I got together on RTRFM for a interview on Morning Magazine.

MP3

It went pretty well — I only had one brain fart, which is pretty good for that time of day.

The real action happened at night, when 300 people packed the UWA Tav. Sincere apologies to everyone that had to be turned away. We had an inkling that it would be big, but in retrospect, maybe we should have hired the Octagon. Wait — no beer in the Octagon. Oh, well.

First was the film, and it was great to see Christopher Hitchens at his most fluid and incisive. Douglas Wilson was a surprisingly tenacious fighter, and some of his arguments made me think, I must confess.

Then the discussion with me and Ben. I noticed a couple of things. One, people stuck around for it and didn’t just leave after the film. That was a nice surprise. The other was how quiet the audience was. You’d think 300 tavern-goers would form a boisterous crowd, but they didn’t. It was scary-quiet. I suppose the civilised nature of the documentary set the tone. There was an exception: toward the end one biology maniac could no longer restrain himself, and began explaining to everyone loudly about mirror neurons. There’s always one. I did appreciate the assist, though.

Anyway, I think I managed to address the strengths of atheism, and Ben had a chance to get his message out, too. Overall, a very successful evening, and a fun time.

There were cameras, and we’re working on a YouTube version of the discussion. In the meantime, here is a still.

If you were there, put your impressions of the night in comments.

Collision! Christians and Atheists! Mass panic!

The UWA Atheist and Agnostic Society is putting on an event with the UWA Christian Union: a screening of the film ‘Collision‘ featuring Christopher Hitchens and Douglas Wilson.

And after the film, Ben Rae of the Christian Union and I will conduct a thoughtful and good-hearted discussion of issues involving faith and disbelief. We won’t even hit each other with chairs (very hard). Instead, we shall sit with our respective cups of tea and exchange views. I gotta be nice? Well, no. Like Hitchens and Wilson, we disagree on things (sometimes strongly so), but we can do so with mutual positive regard.

It’s all going down on Thursday, 5 August at the UWA Tav. You can come even if you’re not a UWA person. Tickets $5.

Obligatory Facebook event.

Doesn’t do much, does he?

Revelation is not good evidence

I had an exchange with a Mormon friend a little while ago. His interesting but ultimately vacuous argument went something like this:

“You say you rely on evidence for the things you believe. But you’re only relying on physical, tangible evidence. You’re not relying on spiritual evidence, and so you’re only getting part of the picture. I’m using the full range of evidence available to us.”

My response is two-fold:

1) There is no empirical evidence for the claims of religion, including the existence of a god, the reality of an afterlife, or various details such as a Tower of Babel, gold plates, or Lamanites. The key doctrines of religious belief systems are either unsupported by evidence, or refuted by evidence. (Occasionally a religion will teach a principle that turns out to be valid — the Mormon prohibition on smoking seems worthwhile on its face — but these are things that could have occured to someone without requiring revelation.)

2) What my friend was calling ‘spiritual evidence’ is actually not good evidence at all. I think he was referring to something Mormons call ‘personal revelation’ — messages that people think they’re getting through prayer.

This is not a good way of finding out what’s true. How you feel about a proposition has nothing to do with whether it’s true or not. You can feel great about things that are completely false. Yet this method is at the very heart of the Mormon conversion experience — and other forms of Christianity also place an emphasis on emotional reasoning.

Let’s take a step back and see how this plays out in LDS missionary work.

LDS missionaries encourage investigators to ‘experiment upon the word‘. And the experiment that they propose is that you can pray and receive answers about the truth of their message telepathically from a god.

They rely on a scripture from the Book of Mormon, Moroni 10:4, which says to ask God, and the Holy Ghost will tell you if it’s true. By doing this, the missionaries commit the fallacy of begging the question — they claim that a god will tell you that the religion is true, but the existence of said god is the very premise under consideration.

And how does the Holy Spirit let you know?

But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,

Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.

That’s a pretty big list of fruits. Almost any feeling could qualify as a confirmation, especially if that’s the conclusion you want to come to, and you wouldn’t be asking if you didn’t have at least a glimmer of hope that it was true.

It should be obvious that this is not a real scientific experiment, and not just because it falls back on supernatural explanations.

  • Scientific experiments use evidence that is empirical — involving sense data that could be observed by anyone
  • Experiments try and control for bias
  • Experiments are replicable — anyone can repeat the experiment, and they should get about the same result. Ideas are verified by multiple points of view.

But so-called personal revelation doesn’t follow these controls.

  • Your feelings can’t be directly observed by other people. That makes it impossible to evaluate someone else’s religious claims, and that means that religious people have to ‘agree to disagree’ when they get conflicting revelations.
  • There’s no way to tell whether the feeling you’re getting is a real live revelation from a god, something from your own mind, or (worse) a temptation from an evil spirit, if you go for that. Or Zeus, Krishna, or the Flying Spaghetti Monster. It’s easy to distinguish between two competing natural claims, but it’s impossible to distinguish between two competing supernatural claims.
  • A scientific experiment attempts to control for bias, but here, the missionaries are subtlely biasing their subjects by telling them what they should expect to feel. It’s sort of like when you’re playing records backwards for satanic messages — it’s hard to tell what the message is until someone gives you the words.
  • The goalposts for this test are defined very vaguely and can be shifted. A confirmation can be ginned up out of the most meager of subjective data — or no data at all. Many are the members who ask for a revelation, get none, and continue in the church anyway, figuring that if they have real faith, they don’t need a spiritual confirmation. It’s a hit if you have good feelings, and hit if you don’t.
  • In a real experiment, we would try to account for both positive and negative results. But here, no attempt is made to add negative results to the sample. People who report a positive result show up in church, but people who get no result don’t, and are effectively deleted from the sample. In fact, if someone doesn’t get a revelation, it’s assumed that they are to blame for not being ‘sincere’ or trying hard enough. They are encouraged to repeat the test until they get a result that the experimenter will like.
  • Worse still, once someone is convinced that they’ve received a message from a god, Latter-day Saints then make a series of logical leaps to show that the whole church is true, from the Book of Mormon to Joseph Smith to Thomas Monson and beyond. All from good feelings and not from anything solid.

Not everyone is convinced by this test, but the church doesn’t need everyone to buy it — just enough people to keep the system going. And I can tell you from personal experience that when you think you’ve been touched by the divine, it can be very difficult to balance that against real evidence. No good evidence is going to come out of this kind of test. This is not a valid experiment. It is a recipe for self-deception. It is just asking to be fooled.

Missionaries or linguists?

Some linguists are saying that the documentation of every human language should be complete by 2015. That’s good, right?

Erm

Protestant translators expect to have the Bible — or at least some of it — written in every one of the world’s 6,909 spoken languages.

“We’re in the greatest period of acceleration in 20 centuries of Bible translation,” said Morrison resident Paul Edwards, who heads up Wycliffe Bible Translators’ $1 billion Last Languages Campaign.

A lot of work in linguistics has historically been done by Protestant missionaries, including the Wycliffe Bible Translators and SIL International. They take their cue from the scriptural injunction to preach Christianity to all nations.

I’m actually glad that they’re documenting languages. Or rather, they’re translating the Bible into various languages, and hopefully documenting more about the language along the way. It needs to be done. I don’t even mind that their translation efforts are focused on the Bible. It’s a good basic text, a little archaic, but not bad for expressing a good number of concepts. And as a bonus, the Bible has already been translated in many languages, and the texts are already aligned by chapter and verse. It’s like the ultimate cross-lingual parallel corpus! Potentially good for machine translation.

What concerns me about these efforts is that they come into it with what amounts to a Christian agenda. Despite protestations to the contrary.

“Wycliffe missionaries don’t evangelize, teach theology, hold Bible study or start churches. They give (preliterate people) a written language,” Edwards said. “They teach them to read and write in their mother tongue.”

The missionaries develop alphabets. They create reading primers. They translate the Bible.

Distributing bibles is evangelising. The difference between making bibles and more overt conversion efforts is a thin line. (Although in one case, the conversion backfired.)

What’s more, this Bible-driven approach to language documentation misses a key point of language. A language — its vocabulary, kinship terms, lexical categories, and even speech acts — encodes some social ideas that are incomprehensible from outside the system. Coming in to promote a Christian worldview can only hamper the understanding of the language.

Watch the line between linguist and missionary vanish as this volunteer waxes rhapsodic about the effort.

“I am excited to put God’s word in all people’s heart language,” Zartman said. “Until people can read the Bible in their own language, God is a foreign concept.”

You mean the Christian god is a foreign concept. And it ought to stay that way. Help them by documenting their language, but leave the imported religion at home.

Yes, she is.

Julia Gillard, the prime minister of Australia, is an atheist. For a while there, I wasn’t sure, but she came out this morning in a radio interview.

Do you believe in God?

No, I don’t, John. I’m not a religious person.

I’ll write some more on this later, but I just wanted to light a celebratory sparkler. Isn’t it great that Australia is a country where a politician doesn’t have to pretend to believe in supernatural beings, and can still get elected as a head of government…

Erm. Maybe I should hold off on the celebration until after the elections.

Ask an atheist: What is god like?

I sometimes contribute to ‘Ask the Atheists‘. Here’s a recent question.

What is your concept of God in His most crucial essence?

Rather an odd question to pose to atheists, don’t you think? Someone posed the same question to Richard Dawkins once, and he said he found it absurd.

Here’s how I answered it.
= – = – = – = – = – = – = – = – = – =
I’d like to describe the crucial attributes of God, and I’m not going to let a little thing like not believing in him stop me.

First, I’d say that God is intelligent. (Joseph Smith said that, and went on to found one of the dumbest religions of all time.) Because God is so intelligent, he’d be far too smart to invent a dumb thing like creationism, intelligent design, or intelligent design creationism. He’d surely see through the ridiculous charlatanry known as faith healing. He’d also be too smart to need numbskull apologists to defend him using poor reasoning, logical fallacies, and doomed arguments. Maybe they should cut it out.

Apparently, he controls everything, listens to billions of prayers, and (I have heard) is responsible for all the physical processes in the universe. That means he’s a busy guy. So he’d be far too busy to care what people are doing with their naughty bits. He also wouldn’t care about gay people getting married, how low women’s hemlines or necklines are, what kind of underwear people are wearing, or any of a thousand details about food and drink, meat preparation, hair length, language use, or social customs that religious systems concern themselves with for the supposed well-being of their members.

He created the world, and everything that in it is. That includes fossils and rocks that are millions of years old. That would suggest that he wants people to believe that the earth is much older than the 6,000 – 10,000 years that Christian fundamentalists believe it is. Why do they ignore the evidence that comes from the world that their god created? And why don’t they believe the fact of evolution? If he’s the god of truth, shouldn’t they quit trying to ignore facts? Doesn’t that sound like they’re not being respectful to him?

God created a lot of women. I happen to think they’re quite nice-looking, and since I’m created in God’s image, I bet he likes the way they look too. He’d probably be offended if someone tried to cover them in yards of fabric. Or if anyone tried to mutilate their genitals. Or burn them, cut off their noses, or honour-kill them for not being sufficiently obedient.

In other words, from what I can tell of God’s crucial attributes, I think he’d be as disgusted with the attempts of humans to worship him as I am. If he existed, that is.

Sunday blasphemy: Get your patriarchal blessing online!

If you never got your patriarchal blessing — maybe you’re ex-Mormon now and it’s too late — well, now you can get it online.

Please note that the validity of the inspired pronouncements in your blessing depend for their self-fulfilment on numerous complex and interacting variables including:
• Your tribal ancestry/heritage;
• Free agency;
• Your adherence to the solemn admonitions within your blessing;
• The changing mind of God;
• Supervening circumstances;
• Your astrological birth/star sign;
• Ongoing evolutionary changes in church doctrine;
Etc.

For the uninitiated, Mormons have a belief that when a certain old man lays his clammy hands on your head and goes into a kind of trance, a supernatural being gives him information about the rest of your life. He says a bunch of vague stock phrases which get typed up and presented to you. It’s called a patriarchal blessing, and you’re meant to consider it as your own personal scripture.

But really, the patriarchal blessing is the Mormon equivalent of a psychic reading. All sincere, I’m sure, but like other psychics, the ‘patriarch’ gleans info about you, and then outputs something that sounds spiritual. People accept the hits, and reinterpret the misses.

The problem comes when people believe this nonsense, and try to guide their lives by bogus oracles. One friend of mine was convinced that she was going to die young because of some vague pronouncement in her PB. (I’m pleased to say she’s still alive and healthy.) The actual phrase in question was rather innocuous, but when you convince someone that random drivel from a stranger is divine revelation, you can’t blame them for being bad interpreters.

I think the site gives an excellent imitation of the writing style that Mormon patriarchs always seem to come up with. About the only thing missing is the bit where they tell you that you’re from the tribe of Ephraim. Well, if you’re Caucasian.

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